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	<title>Comments on: Cash Games</title>
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		<title>By: Cause Everyone Else is Doing It&#8230; &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Cash Games Followup</title>
		<link>http://www.mookie99.com/cash-games/comment-page-1/#comment-548</link>
		<dc:creator>Cause Everyone Else is Doing It&#8230; &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Cash Games Followup</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jun 2006 05:17:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mookie99.bigopokerroom.com/?p=271#comment-548</guid>
		<description>[...] Everyone Else is Doing It&#8230;     &#171; Cash Games    Cash Games Followup June 20th,2006 [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Everyone Else is Doing It&#8230;     &laquo; Cash Games    Cash Games Followup June 20th,2006 [...]</p>
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		<title>By: mookie99</title>
		<link>http://www.mookie99.com/cash-games/comment-page-1/#comment-549</link>
		<dc:creator>mookie99</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jun 2006 04:19:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mookie99.bigopokerroom.com/?p=271#comment-549</guid>
		<description>Wow Don, so much great stuff.  Never really checked out how many tables each player was sitting in.  I can definitely tell I have a lot to learn and work on.

There is so much good advice here in the comments, about 10 posts worth.  Someone could compile it all and start writing a book - Mastering NL Cash Games In the Land of Set Farmers &amp; Beaver Trappers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Wow Don, so much great stuff.  Never really checked out how many tables each player was sitting in.  I can definitely tell I have a lot to learn and work on.</p>
<p>There is so much good advice here in the comments, about 10 posts worth.  Someone could compile it all and start writing a book &#8211; Mastering NL Cash Games In the Land of Set Farmers &amp; Beaver Trappers.</p>
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		<title>By: Miami Don</title>
		<link>http://www.mookie99.com/cash-games/comment-page-1/#comment-547</link>
		<dc:creator>Miami Don</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 23:21:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mookie99.bigopokerroom.com/?p=271#comment-547</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m much more of a live player but I&#039;ll give you some of my thoughts on online tables for people just getting into the cash games.

First I would stick to nine player tables and avoid six player tables. Six player games are for more advanced players, or guys that have to have action so stay away if you&#039;re fairly new to playing cash games.

Table Selection- this applies mostly to Stars. There are usually 20+ games to choose from and you have plenty of players, no matter the level, that six and eight table games. I make sure that there is no more that two of these multi-tablers at that table and they both are on your right. They are so very predictable that if they fire and you have nothing fold, but if you hit sets, straights, or flushes against them they will pay with there whole stack as they only play their cards and not any of their opponents. I also like to find games with as many small stacks as possible and few if any players that have doubled up. At the big sites you can meet these requirements it just takes a few minutes to find the right table.

Play tight-aggressive.

Play solid cards, play in position but on occasion don&#039;t be afraid to limp with  even low suited connectors. If the hit you&#039;ll get paid and you can also get off the hands quick. I&#039;m very cautious about playing K-J, Q-T, type of hands. Unless you hit straights or flushes your usually behind and these hands are huge chip eaters IMO. Ace rag sucks don&#039;t get in the habit of playing these cards as they&#039;re chip eaters too. Smaller suited cards from 8-9 to 4-5 can get you paid when they hit.

Play straight forward and don&#039;t get too cute trying to trap or check-raise. Stay aggressive. If your in the BB and you hit a set bet it. If you got A-A preflop bet it, if there is a raise before you re-raise.

Don&#039;t be afraid to throw away any hand. Too many people fall in love with hands and get stacked when they should fold. At the same time don&#039;t be pushed around. If you think you have the best hand raise or re-raise, if you think you&#039;re beat fold.

Work hard at reading players and betting patterns. Try to stay alert and put players on hands even if you have folded. This to me is invaluable as it comes into play as you advance in level and it helps to become more comfortable playing for cash.

Don&#039;t play at levels beyond your comfort zone. We all get stacked when it happens don&#039;t let it bother you and it shouldn&#039;t if you are playing within your means.

Think long term and not short term. Good plays with bad results are better long term than bad plays with good results, this is where leaks and bad habits start.

Play with confidence and not scared. As a player you are capable of playing for cash.

Hope that wasn&#039;t a ramble I just threw some ideas out there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m much more of a live player but I&#8217;ll give you some of my thoughts on online tables for people just getting into the cash games.</p>
<p>First I would stick to nine player tables and avoid six player tables. Six player games are for more advanced players, or guys that have to have action so stay away if you&#8217;re fairly new to playing cash games.</p>
<p>Table Selection- this applies mostly to Stars. There are usually 20+ games to choose from and you have plenty of players, no matter the level, that six and eight table games. I make sure that there is no more that two of these multi-tablers at that table and they both are on your right. They are so very predictable that if they fire and you have nothing fold, but if you hit sets, straights, or flushes against them they will pay with there whole stack as they only play their cards and not any of their opponents. I also like to find games with as many small stacks as possible and few if any players that have doubled up. At the big sites you can meet these requirements it just takes a few minutes to find the right table.</p>
<p>Play tight-aggressive.</p>
<p>Play solid cards, play in position but on occasion don&#8217;t be afraid to limp with  even low suited connectors. If the hit you&#8217;ll get paid and you can also get off the hands quick. I&#8217;m very cautious about playing K-J, Q-T, type of hands. Unless you hit straights or flushes your usually behind and these hands are huge chip eaters IMO. Ace rag sucks don&#8217;t get in the habit of playing these cards as they&#8217;re chip eaters too. Smaller suited cards from 8-9 to 4-5 can get you paid when they hit.</p>
<p>Play straight forward and don&#8217;t get too cute trying to trap or check-raise. Stay aggressive. If your in the BB and you hit a set bet it. If you got A-A preflop bet it, if there is a raise before you re-raise.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t be afraid to throw away any hand. Too many people fall in love with hands and get stacked when they should fold. At the same time don&#8217;t be pushed around. If you think you have the best hand raise or re-raise, if you think you&#8217;re beat fold.</p>
<p>Work hard at reading players and betting patterns. Try to stay alert and put players on hands even if you have folded. This to me is invaluable as it comes into play as you advance in level and it helps to become more comfortable playing for cash.</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t play at levels beyond your comfort zone. We all get stacked when it happens don&#8217;t let it bother you and it shouldn&#8217;t if you are playing within your means.</p>
<p>Think long term and not short term. Good plays with bad results are better long term than bad plays with good results, this is where leaks and bad habits start.</p>
<p>Play with confidence and not scared. As a player you are capable of playing for cash.</p>
<p>Hope that wasn&#8217;t a ramble I just threw some ideas out there.</p>
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		<title>By: mookie99</title>
		<link>http://www.mookie99.com/cash-games/comment-page-1/#comment-546</link>
		<dc:creator>mookie99</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 22:07:45 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mookie99.bigopokerroom.com/?p=271#comment-546</guid>
		<description>JJ, thanks again for all the info.  I look forward to reading your post.

CC, set farmers and beaver trappers huh...never heard those references before.  Pretty funny.  I have already experienced what you mean about table makeup where most of the table is solid and tighter than tight.

I assume you also use tools like Pokertracker and Poker office.

Your last point is all about thinking a step or two ahead.  This is something that I haven&#039;t done much of and will need to work on.  This makes a lot of sense  and probably takes some of the emotion out of your decisions.

This is all really great stuff and I really appreciate you all taking the time to contribute.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JJ, thanks again for all the info.  I look forward to reading your post.</p>
<p>CC, set farmers and beaver trappers huh&#8230;never heard those references before.  Pretty funny.  I have already experienced what you mean about table makeup where most of the table is solid and tighter than tight.</p>
<p>I assume you also use tools like Pokertracker and Poker office.</p>
<p>Your last point is all about thinking a step or two ahead.  This is something that I haven&#8217;t done much of and will need to work on.  This makes a lot of sense  and probably takes some of the emotion out of your decisions.</p>
<p>This is all really great stuff and I really appreciate you all taking the time to contribute.</p>
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		<title>By: cc</title>
		<link>http://www.mookie99.com/cash-games/comment-page-1/#comment-545</link>
		<dc:creator>cc</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 21:50:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mookie99.bigopokerroom.com/?p=271#comment-545</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m a cash game expert (lol).

Having said that in NLHE, a few thoughts:

&gt;&gt; Most folks in NLHE subscribe to 30-100x of the buy-in for bankroll management, depending on your risk tolerance.
&gt;&gt; The different buy-in levels can have very different dynamics (open limping six way pots at $25 NLHE, never seeing this at $200NLHE--ok, never is a strong term).
&gt;&gt; Set farmers, beaver trappers, and ultra-tight multi-tablers are more prevalent than in tourneys.  With escalating blinds, you can only do so much.  Set farmers, of course, are those who basically just look for flopped sets to double up, and beaver trappers are those who play gapped connectors and junk waiting to trap solid players.
&gt;&gt; Beyond table selection, be cognizant of table makeup after you sit.  When you suddenly have half the table made up of 12/8&#039;ers and other rock/eagle types, hit the road.
&gt;&gt; Location, location, location combined with faking.  Most folks out of position who you have any data on aren&#039;t faking out of position.  It happens obviously alot, but not mostly.
&gt;&gt; Know what you&#039;ll do if the other guy does something after you do something.

That&#039;s probably enough gibberish.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m a cash game expert (lol).</p>
<p>Having said that in NLHE, a few thoughts:</p>
<p>&gt;&gt; Most folks in NLHE subscribe to 30-100x of the buy-in for bankroll management, depending on your risk tolerance.<br />
&gt;&gt; The different buy-in levels can have very different dynamics (open limping six way pots at $25 NLHE, never seeing this at $200NLHE&#8211;ok, never is a strong term).<br />
&gt;&gt; Set farmers, beaver trappers, and ultra-tight multi-tablers are more prevalent than in tourneys.  With escalating blinds, you can only do so much.  Set farmers, of course, are those who basically just look for flopped sets to double up, and beaver trappers are those who play gapped connectors and junk waiting to trap solid players.<br />
&gt;&gt; Beyond table selection, be cognizant of table makeup after you sit.  When you suddenly have half the table made up of 12/8&#8242;ers and other rock/eagle types, hit the road.<br />
&gt;&gt; Location, location, location combined with faking.  Most folks out of position who you have any data on aren&#8217;t faking out of position.  It happens obviously alot, but not mostly.<br />
&gt;&gt; Know what you&#8217;ll do if the other guy does something after you do something.</p>
<p>That&#8217;s probably enough gibberish.</p>
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		<title>By: jjok</title>
		<link>http://www.mookie99.com/cash-games/comment-page-1/#comment-544</link>
		<dc:creator>jjok</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 21:37:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mookie99.bigopokerroom.com/?p=271#comment-544</guid>
		<description>I used those numbers strictly as a guideline for the very beginning.  If you have $500 and feel comfortable playing the $50NL tables, then do it.  I started out at the $100NL tables only because I was comfortable with the play.....and I think that was kind of a mistake.  I have been so up and down it would make your head spin.  And I anticipate being here for a while.

As for bankroll for other poker interests.....while I don&#039;t specifically seperate my roll for tourneys, I do &quot;earmark&quot; a few bucks towards tourney and SNG play.  It&#039;s usually not significant though.....say $200-$300 for the month.

I&#039;m feeling a post coming......</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I used those numbers strictly as a guideline for the very beginning.  If you have $500 and feel comfortable playing the $50NL tables, then do it.  I started out at the $100NL tables only because I was comfortable with the play&#8230;..and I think that was kind of a mistake.  I have been so up and down it would make your head spin.  And I anticipate being here for a while.</p>
<p>As for bankroll for other poker interests&#8230;..while I don&#8217;t specifically seperate my roll for tourneys, I do &#8220;earmark&#8221; a few bucks towards tourney and SNG play.  It&#8217;s usually not significant though&#8230;..say $200-$300 for the month.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m feeling a post coming&#8230;&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: mookie99</title>
		<link>http://www.mookie99.com/cash-games/comment-page-1/#comment-543</link>
		<dc:creator>mookie99</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 20:14:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mookie99.bigopokerroom.com/?p=271#comment-543</guid>
		<description>Thanks again for all the feedback.  This is great.

JJ, I think initially I will start out playing the full 9-10 handed tables and then maybe in the future venture into the aggro 6-handed tables.  The bankroll numbers are very interesting and have reaffirmed my thinking of sticking to the $25NL tables for now.  A follow up question to that is do you separate your cash roll from your tourney roll ?

Acorn, beyond the stack sizes, % players to the flop and actual seat selection (if possible) what other things do you consider when it comes to table selection ?  I have used Poker Office in the past with tourney play but it got in the way with chat since I had to turn on the verbose mode to pick up the hands.

Chris, I enjoyed watching everyone kill the tourney tables last night.  I think it&#039;s awesome people are willing to read and answer questions like these to help out donks like me.  There aren&#039;t many books out on NL cash games and the ones that are probably weren&#039;t written with low limit guys like me in mind.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks again for all the feedback.  This is great.</p>
<p>JJ, I think initially I will start out playing the full 9-10 handed tables and then maybe in the future venture into the aggro 6-handed tables.  The bankroll numbers are very interesting and have reaffirmed my thinking of sticking to the $25NL tables for now.  A follow up question to that is do you separate your cash roll from your tourney roll ?</p>
<p>Acorn, beyond the stack sizes, % players to the flop and actual seat selection (if possible) what other things do you consider when it comes to table selection ?  I have used Poker Office in the past with tourney play but it got in the way with chat since I had to turn on the verbose mode to pick up the hands.</p>
<p>Chris, I enjoyed watching everyone kill the tourney tables last night.  I think it&#8217;s awesome people are willing to read and answer questions like these to help out donks like me.  There aren&#8217;t many books out on NL cash games and the ones that are probably weren&#8217;t written with low limit guys like me in mind.</p>
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		<title>By: drewspop</title>
		<link>http://www.mookie99.com/cash-games/comment-page-1/#comment-542</link>
		<dc:creator>drewspop</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 19:50:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mookie99.bigopokerroom.com/?p=271#comment-542</guid>
		<description>Thanks for railing last night and good luck with the cash games.  Glad you asked the questions so I can pick up some advice at the same time by tuning in.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for railing last night and good luck with the cash games.  Glad you asked the questions so I can pick up some advice at the same time by tuning in.</p>
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		<title>By: littleacornman</title>
		<link>http://www.mookie99.com/cash-games/comment-page-1/#comment-541</link>
		<dc:creator>littleacornman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 19:42:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mookie99.bigopokerroom.com/?p=271#comment-541</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m by no means an &quot;expert cash&quot; player but from my experience at the 6 max micros the advice already given by Falstaff and jjok is good.

I would add table selection as a crucial difference and also be aware that while you can put someone to the test ( all in)in a cash game they can always reload and are more likely to call than in an MTT where their tourney life is on the line.

Having a sufficent bankroll is crucial to being able to shrug off the bad beats.I know jjok already said that but it&#039;s so important it&#039;s worth repeating.

I&#039;m sure there&#039;s loads more I could think of but the last important difference that comes to mind is that Pokertrackers Gametime + can be used at cash tables and not sngs.I&#039;ve only had it working ( GT +) a couple of months and wouldn&#039;t play without it.

good luck...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m by no means an &#8220;expert cash&#8221; player but from my experience at the 6 max micros the advice already given by Falstaff and jjok is good.</p>
<p>I would add table selection as a crucial difference and also be aware that while you can put someone to the test ( all in)in a cash game they can always reload and are more likely to call than in an MTT where their tourney life is on the line.</p>
<p>Having a sufficent bankroll is crucial to being able to shrug off the bad beats.I know jjok already said that but it&#8217;s so important it&#8217;s worth repeating.</p>
<p>I&#8217;m sure there&#8217;s loads more I could think of but the last important difference that comes to mind is that Pokertrackers Gametime + can be used at cash tables and not sngs.I&#8217;ve only had it working ( GT +) a couple of months and wouldn&#8217;t play without it.</p>
<p>good luck&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: jjok</title>
		<link>http://www.mookie99.com/cash-games/comment-page-1/#comment-540</link>
		<dc:creator>jjok</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jun 2006 18:24:40 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://mookie99.bigopokerroom.com/?p=271#comment-540</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m still learning alot from cash games......

First off, I&#039;d decide whether you want to invest the time with a full-ring or 6-max.  I play 6-max, much to the dismay of others who think it&#039;s too aggressive of a game.  It is aggressive but can be very profitable.

The dynamics of cash games is different.  You don&#039;t have to worry about blinds.  You don&#039;t tighten up during situations like hand-for-hand or bubbles.  Every hand is a new hand.  Getting to play each hand fresh is a lot different.  Tourneys are finite.  There is an end result.  You either lose, get in the money, or win.  Cash games are as infinite as your bankroll.  If someone donkeys you out of a big pot, you can reload and get it back.....although a true strategy says playing vengeful doesn&#039;t pay......

Since there is no bubble, I think a cash game player needs to see a few more flops.  75s, T9o, etc.  So long as position is respected in making the decision to play sub-obtimal cards.  Speculation can go a long way, but tread carefully.  And don&#039;t open-limp past the MP.

As for bankroll, it&#039;s hard to say.  I would say 20Xbuyin to start and increase it as you go up.

$500 for $25NL
$1000 for $50 NL
$2500 for $100 NL
$6000 for $200 NL

I&#039;m just pulling some numbers off the top of my head for this......in reality, it&#039;s playing at a comfortable level where you are not going to be worried every hand.

My worst night I dropped 4 buyins, while it stung, the roll wasn&#039;t nearly impacted %-wise.  So don&#039;t play above your means......because you will have your donkey nights......

Good luck man......it&#039;s a fun ride.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m still learning alot from cash games&#8230;&#8230;</p>
<p>First off, I&#8217;d decide whether you want to invest the time with a full-ring or 6-max.  I play 6-max, much to the dismay of others who think it&#8217;s too aggressive of a game.  It is aggressive but can be very profitable.</p>
<p>The dynamics of cash games is different.  You don&#8217;t have to worry about blinds.  You don&#8217;t tighten up during situations like hand-for-hand or bubbles.  Every hand is a new hand.  Getting to play each hand fresh is a lot different.  Tourneys are finite.  There is an end result.  You either lose, get in the money, or win.  Cash games are as infinite as your bankroll.  If someone donkeys you out of a big pot, you can reload and get it back&#8230;..although a true strategy says playing vengeful doesn&#8217;t pay&#8230;&#8230;</p>
<p>Since there is no bubble, I think a cash game player needs to see a few more flops.  75s, T9o, etc.  So long as position is respected in making the decision to play sub-obtimal cards.  Speculation can go a long way, but tread carefully.  And don&#8217;t open-limp past the MP.</p>
<p>As for bankroll, it&#8217;s hard to say.  I would say 20Xbuyin to start and increase it as you go up.</p>
<p>$500 for $25NL<br />
$1000 for $50 NL<br />
$2500 for $100 NL<br />
$6000 for $200 NL</p>
<p>I&#8217;m just pulling some numbers off the top of my head for this&#8230;&#8230;in reality, it&#8217;s playing at a comfortable level where you are not going to be worried every hand.</p>
<p>My worst night I dropped 4 buyins, while it stung, the roll wasn&#8217;t nearly impacted %-wise.  So don&#8217;t play above your means&#8230;&#8230;because you will have your donkey nights&#8230;&#8230;</p>
<p>Good luck man&#8230;&#8230;it&#8217;s a fun ride.</p>
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